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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2012 3:13 pm 
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This is beginning to look like a discussion between and about dumb and dumber. Or in other words a union agitator and and over zealous supervisor being discussed by people that are running out of logical comments and are groping for something to say just to make a point that doesn't exist. :roll:

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2012 4:12 pm 
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As far as child molesters and drug dealers go, all I am saying is that the logic you are using to defend Walker (i.e. he was tricked into it, so he didn't mean it, and everything is OK) was allowed by our legal system as a proper defense, then there would be a lot more criminals on the street because it wouldn't count if they were tricked into doing a crime by the police.


I hate to tell you this, but what you have described is not allowed by our legal system. You have descibed police entrapment perfectly, and it's not legal. If a person is "tricked" into commiting an illegal act it is entrapment. If the police provide cause that results in a person commiting an illegal act, without that person initiating the crime, they have violated the law. The criminal must initiate the illegal act. Calling a suspect, representing yourself as another, and baiting them into saying something illegal, and recording it to boot....if a cop did that a defense wouldn't be needed because it would never make it to court.

I'm not trying to apply any of this to the previosly mentioned unethical, amoral scamming of our govenor, you can do that yourself. From a more informed viewpoint this time. I just wanted to correct the fallacies presended in your post regarding police entrapment.

Yes, about that sign. I'm not sure how you've confirmed any facts in this case. I'll I've read so far are accusations. from one side. There's no way that a factual summary of the events could be assumed at this point.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2012 9:40 pm 
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None of these incidents would be occurring if it where not for the lack of statesman abilities in Scott Walker. Never before in history has a governor gone to recall and polarized and divided the citizens to this extent.

The Tea Party Pawns wanted him, they got him.
http://www.deathandtaxesmag.com/32153/a ... -brothers/


Last edited by sagan on Sat Jan 14, 2012 10:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2012 9:58 pm 
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What is frightening is the escalating threats of violence of the Walker supporters who now fear that he or a republican senator may be recalled.

Look at the case of Carl Sosnoski threatening to kill a Recall petitioner practicing his contitutional rights. You may check the WI Circuit Court systems for Sosnoski's case.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgD_Hoyc ... r_embedded

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/12/3 ... lker:-You-

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2012 10:30 pm 
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Apparently there is some about citizen rights being exercised that just enrages them:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... wb6EZ_uv5w


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2012 6:17 am 
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$cott Walker has divided this state, and seems very proud of it. :D He was bought and paid for, and delivered the goods to his billionair and corporate buddies. :x


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2012 9:04 pm 
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RECALL THE GIANTS!

I do not like the result of the Packer game Sunday. I would like to file with the NFL to circulate recall petitions against the New York Giants to force them into another NFC Divisional Playoff game on the grounds that I am unhappy that my team lost. In the new Wisconsin tradition, I am "posting" this to make sure we get enough signatures. Feel free to sign 83 times (or make up names)...

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2012 8:43 am 
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Not quite the same Old Scout. The outcome of the Packer game is of their own making, not the voting public. 'Nuff said.

Along those same lines can't stand Eli, can't stand Tom. But dang, Brandon Jacobs of the Giants has the best deep voice around. Go Giants.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 12:28 am 
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Check out this article from the Wall Street Journal.

The Greece Next Door
Illinois gets a credit downgrade, in contrast to Wisconsin.

REVIEW & OUTLOOK JANUARY 20, 2012
Run up spending and debt, raise taxes in the naming of balancing the budget, but then watch as
deficits rise and your credit-rating falls anyway. That's been the sad pattern in Europe, and now
it's hitting that mecca of tax-and-spend government known as Illinois.
Though too few noticed, this month Moody's downgraded Illinois state debt to A2 from A1, the
lowest among the 50 states. That's worse even than California. The state's cost of borrowing for
$800 million of new 10-year general obligation bonds rose to 3.1%—which is 110 basis points
higher than the 2% on top-rated 10-year bonds of more financially secure states.
This wasn't supposed to happen. Only a year ago, Governor Pat Quinn and his fellow Democrats
raised individual income taxes by 67% and the corporate tax rate by 46%. They did it to raise $7
billion in revenue, as the Governor put it, to "get Illinois back on fiscal sound footing" and
improve the state's credit rating.

So much for that. In its downgrade statement, Moody's panned Illinois lawmakers for "a
legislative session in which the state took no steps to implement lasting solutions to its severe
pension underfunding or to its chronic bill payment delays." An analysis by Bloomberg finds that
the assets in the pension fund will only cover "45% of projected liabilities, the least of any state."
And—no surprise—in part because the tax increases have caused companies to leave Illinois, the
state budget office confesses that as of this month the state still has $6.8 billion in unpaid bills
and unaddressed obligations.

It's worth contrasting this grim picture with that of Wisconsin north of the border. Last winter
Madison was occupied by thousands of union protesters trying to bully legislators to defeat
Republican Governor Scott Walker's plan to require government workers to pay a larger share of
their health-plan costs, and to shore up the pension system by trimming future retirement
liabilities. The reforms passed anyway.

In contrast to the Illinois downgrade, Moody's has praised Mr. Walker's budget as "credit positive
for Wisconsin," adding that the money-saving reforms bring "the state's finances closer to a
structural budgetary balance." As a result, Wisconsin jumped in Chief Executive magazine's 2011
ranking of each state's business climate—moving to 17th from 41st. Illinois dropped to 48th from
45th as ranked by the nation's top CEOs.

Yet Mr. Walker, who balanced the budget without new taxes, is the governor facing a union financed
attempt to recall him from office this year. If Wisconsin voters want to see where a state
ends up without the kind of reforms that Mr. Walker made, they need only look to the Greece
next door.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 7:12 am 
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The Wall Street article was a weak attempt to sugarcoat what $cott Walker did. He divided the state to a new level. It may never be the same again. We now lead the Nation in jobs lost, and is dead last in new jobs.

He`s made himself a millionaire, and his billionaire out of state backers even richer.

He`s an evil little man, with evil thoughts.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 1:24 pm 
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KEN wrote:
We now lead the Nation in jobs lost, and is dead last in new jobs.


Hummmm.....I guess Ken knows more than US BLS...LOL



FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Thursday, January 19, 2012
CONTACT: DWD Communications, 608-266-2722
On the Web: http://dwd.wisconsin .gov /dwd/news.htm
On Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/WIWorkforce
On Twitter: @WIWorkforce

WISCONSIN DECEMBER UNEMPLOYMENT RATE DROPS TO 7.1 PERCENT

U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics data show 21,400 more residents working since December ‘10

MADISON – The Department of Workforce Development (DWD) today re leased the U.S. Bureau of Labor
Statistics (BLS) preliminary data for December, showing Wisconsin’s unemploym ent rate dropped to 7.1
percent from 7.3 percent in November and 7.5 percent in December 2010, as the number of Wisconsinites
working increased by 6,900 over the month and by 21,400 since December 2010.

“Our unemployment rate continues to decline and more Wisconsinites are working,” Secretary Reggie
Newson said. “Challenges remain, but the latest dat a show we finished 2011 with more Wisconsinites
working, record postings of over 151,500 on JobCenterofWisconsin.com, and higher state sales and
withholding tax collections over the year, all of which point to economic growth for our state.”


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 1:44 pm 
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They cherry picked for the quote...

Depending on which numbers you look at you'll see Wisconsin actually lost jobs, they're going by the "seasonally adjusted" numbers to claim employment is better. They also are using preliminary numbers, which are historically inaccurate.

To estimate the unemployment numbers they called 1,900 homes and then used that to determine the numbers.

Wait until the final numbers are release before we start guessing how much things are getting better. Wisconsin still is the only state listed by the federal government as trending negative...


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 2:32 pm 
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Seasonal adjustment is the standard for reporting job unemployment rates and has nothing to do with making things look better than they actually are. If you look at the unemployemnt rate of golf caddies in wisconsin in june VS january you wold see a huge increase in unemployment rates in january vs the june statistics. Vice-versa for snowmobile rental agents. Seasonal adjustment just takes that into account.

If you don't like the DWD's recap here is the link to the 1/24/12 report from BLS (in pdf) for State/regonal employment and uneployment for December 2011, giving a recap of the changes for the last year. If you find ANYTHING in this report that supports that Wisconsin has trended or lagged behind please speak-up and point it out. I think you'll find the contrary to be true. http://www.bls.gov/news.release/pdf/laus.pdf

PS - I'll give you a tip, don't try to find any info that supports Ken's claim of 40,000 lost jobs, because it isn't there. That claim is just laughable.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 3:34 pm 
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KEN wrote:
Quote:
It may never be the same again.


God I hope not. If it wasn't for all the changes, I'm not sure how much longer I could have kept up with the tax increases. Between property taxes and all the other tax increases the past few years, being retired I am not sure how much longer I could have been able to afford to keep my house and still be able to pay all my other bills. It was about time we got rid of the tax and spend politicians. It is sad when the unions can hold the rest of us hostage to their demands with no regard for those who are paying the bill.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 7:31 pm 
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River Rat,

These are still just preliminary numbers (aka, a guess). These numbers are changed all the time. Heck, a month or two ago it was pointed out that Walker had used preliminary numbers in one of his big claims about how great Wisconsin was doing, despite being warned multiple times by his own people that they were suspect. It wasn't until later that we found out Wisconsin actually lost jobs at a time he was boasting about how well we were doing.

Lets see where we are this month after the final numbers are released...


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2012 9:48 pm 
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@RiverRat

http://www.politiscoop.com/us-politics/ ... loss-.html

Wisconsin has lost jobs for 6 straight months while the nation as a whole has gained jobs for the last 22 months.

Changes in the unemployment rate are well known to be bogus in a bad economy when people basically stop looking for work and do not count as being unemployed anymore.

If you don't believe me, look at Table 3 in the document that you told everyone to look at. It shows WI lost jobs from October to November and from November to December (not sure how you missed that, unless you think less jobs is a positive trend). It would also show that in the last 6 months WI has lost over 30,000 jobs, but the figures only go back to October.

Walker's economic policies are not working. And quit whining about taxes. Get a job if it's that bad.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 10:06 am 
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If you read the table 3 you'll see unemployment rate drop from 7.7 to 7.1 for the state of wisconsin for the period oct '11-dec'11. Wisconsin has a LOWER unemployment rate than the US @ 8.5%.

You'll also see, for the same period, WI total net jobs drop from 3,057,000 to 3,054,200. A job loss of 2,800. That's less than one one-thousanth of 1% (0.0009163). If your want to call that a downward tend I'd say your wrong, I think a bipartisan statistician would as well.

As far as the link to that propagandic "citizen" political web-site; I'm not going to comment on that. The disclaimer for the site says they are not responsible for the content, LMAO! Nearly all the articals there are written by one guy for gosh sakes.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 11:07 am 
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Dear media,

Have you followed-up with the Ron Mcallister/Lincoln Hills incident? Have you contacted the DOC to see if they will provide a statment re: the issue? Have you determined if their internal investigation has concluded and what actions they have taken as a result?

Now that all the hub-bub and one-sided propaganda have subsided I'd think it's a perfect time to contact Mcallister's supervisor to find out the other side of the story. Have you contacted him? What about his superiors? What about Mcallisters co-workers who may not share the same viewpoint as him - have you indentified them or made an attempt to interview them?

After getting the other side's story how about an in-depth, challangeing follow-up with Mcallister for a rebutal?

please provide answers, thanks.

signed - "seeking the truth"


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 11:34 am 
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http://www.businessweek.com/ap/financia ... LL1VO0.htm

From a report about November job losses in Wisconsin:

"The latest jobs report shows that 14,600 jobs, including 11,700 in the private sector, were lost last month. At the same time, the unemployment rate dropped from 7.7 percent to 7.3 percent."

Still think a drop in unemployment is some sort of amazing statistic? How does the unemployment rate drop .4% when there WI lost 14,600 jobs?

Here is a source that you probably would agree with on most things talking about how the unemployment rate is bogus as an indicator of how the economy is doing: http://www.nationalfreedomforum.com/201 ... mbers.html


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 12:05 pm 
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XYZ1 wrote:
http://www.businessweek.com/ap/financialnews/D9RLL1VO0.htm

From a report about November job losses in Wisconsin:

"The latest jobs report shows that 14,600 jobs, including 11,700 in the private sector, were lost last month. At the same time, the unemployment rate dropped from 7.7 percent to 7.3 percent."



Your data are old. Those numbers were revised and adjusted to 1,500. Less than 1/1000th of 1% net job loss over a 30 day period.

XYZ1 wrote:
How does the unemployment rate drop .4% when there WI lost 14,600 jobs?


The two numbers are derived from diffrent surveys. You have to look at both in totality to get a "feel" of the state of the job market. The idea is to look at trends


If you want an idea of trends here you go:

In 2009 -- Under Democratic Gov. Jim Doyle -- the state suffered a net loss of 121,000 jobs -- 84,700 jobs were lost during the first four months of the year, including 24,700 in April alone.

in 2011 Wisconsin gained a net # of jobs -- 21,400

The junk data that Falk and her cronies fabricate don't hold water. Check out the Journal Sentinal's "truth-o-meter" for a recap on the falicies Falk has uttered.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 3:39 pm 
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The fact is that for the last 6 months Wisconsin has lost jobs while the US as a whole has gained jobs. You cannot dispute that.

When WI was losing jobs under Doyle, so was the rest of the country. Now WI is losing jobs and the rest of the country is gaining jobs.

Trying to use the decrease in unemployment rate to spin this and make it look like Walker is doing a good job is not honest. Do you believe that Obama is doing a great job because the national unemployment rate is going down? I doubt it. The unemployment rate is flawed and both liberals and conservatives know that, so quit using it as a way of saying "Walker is great", unless you're also willing to say "Obama is great".


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 3:42 pm 
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And speaking of the "truth-o-meter", check out the page they have dedicated to Scott Walker:

http://www.politifact.com/personalities/scott-walker/

Here's a hint: he has 5 "trues", 17 "false", and 3 "pants on fire" lies


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 4:53 pm 
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XYZ1 wrote:
And speaking of the "truth-o-meter", check out the page they have dedicated to Scott Walker:

http://www.politifact.com/personalities/scott-walker/

Here's a hint: he has 5 "trues", 17 "false", and 3 "pants on fire" lies


OMG, do you even read this stuff you post? The majority of the quotes reviewed there are not even from Walker. There's even one "false" there atributed to Falk for inacuracies uttered toward Walker!


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 5:33 pm 
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You have to actually click on "False" or "True", etc. to see the stuff Walker said.

http://www.politifact.com/personalities ... ing/false/

Sorry, thought you'd be able to figure that out.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2012 9:45 pm 
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Frankly I don't think xyz1 would Recognize the truth if it bit him in the butt .! :roll:

Obviously the only one he is concerned about is himself. My impression is either on welfare and doesn't want to lose benefits, or a whining union member who is mad because he can't have it his way.

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